
New episode on the Vibescaling Podcast - Jason Gelman, Operating Partner @ Primary.
Been awesome getting to know the great folks at Primary this last year, as we’re both based here in NYC.
Jason is a gem of a guy + it was super interesting to get his PoV of having GTM in VC, along with how they are thinking about sales + AI both internally at the firm but also in their investment thesis.
Thank you all for the kind words on the pod - we'll keep shipping these weekly.
See below for past and future guests:
Some of our previous guests:
Todd Busler, Sales Leader @ Clay - see here
Raphael Parker, former CRO @ Mandolin (former founding GTM hire @ Segment) - see here
Kyle Parrish, former VP of Sales @ Figma, see here
Liam Mulcahy, GTM operating partner @ Kleiner Perkins, see here
Pat Forquer, CRO @ Legora, see here
Mike Donohue, CRO @ Maven, see here
Tomer Chernia, VP of GTM @ Cursor, see here
Jack Gashi, VP of Sales @ Avoca, see here
Eleanor Dorfman, VP of GTM @ Anthropic, see here
Ghazi Masood, CRO @ Replit, see here
Kyle Norton, CRO @ Owner.com, see here
Some of our future guests for Season One:
Evan Cassidy, VP of Sales @ Decagon (recorded, in edits now)
Jason Miller, VP of Sales @ Unify (recorded, in edits now)
Mike Heller, Partner @ Floodgate (former Dropbox & Clearbit GTM) (recorded, in edits now)
Jaquelyn Goldberg, VP of Sales @ Unframe (recorded, in edits now)
Graham Moreno, VP of GTM @ Parallel
Rob Saliterman, VP of Sales @ Harvey
Mark Ebert, SVP of Revenue @ Profound
James White, VP of Sales @ Rogo
Mark Goldberger, VP of Sales @ Metaview
Roy Matthew, VP of Sales @ Gumloop
Navid Zolfaghari, CRO @ Zapier
Dini Mehta, former CRO @ Lattice
& others from our portfolio companies @ vibescaling
And many more in the pipeline - if you know any good leaders who fit this, shoot me a DM on LI or reply to this email. We’ll keep openings rolling and be super open to suggestions for similar guests.
We film in-person in SF & NYC at legit podcast studios and have hired a new post-production agency, so the quality will be high - see below for a snippet in-studio behind the scenes.
Interviewing the awesome Ghazi Masood for this episode, CRO @ Replit, in our NYC studio in February
Links To Sections


Jason’s Background
Jason Gelman is a Go-to-Market Operating Partner at Primary Venture Partners, one of the largest early-stage VC firms in the country — Primary just closed its $625 million Fund V a few weeks ago, bringing total AUM to ~$1.6B.
Before Primary, Jason led Revenue Strategy & Operations at Compass, helping scale the company from ~$100M ARR to $6B through their IPO. He got his start in the New York tech scene after attending law school, where he quickly realized the meritocracy of tech was a better fit than the rigid hierarchies of the legal world.
At Primary, Jason has built out two core programs for portfolio companies: a Market Development team (centralized BD outreach on behalf of founders) and a Go-to-Market Engineering program (tech stack buildout and systems architecture). He's also leading the development of the firm's investment thesis around go-to-market tech.
Interesting Takeaways
"Advice-giving" is not a portfolio support model - it's a placeholder. The pattern Jason kept seeing: operating partner parachutes in, shares a framework from 2018, founder leaves inspired but with nothing to execute. Every program he's built at Primary - hiring support, market dev, GTM engineering - is designed to point to a specific outcome. If he can't answer "what materially moved because of us?" six months later, the program doesn't exist.
Primary's Market Dev team has an unfair advantage no vendor can replicate. They don't lead outreach with the portfolio company. They lead with Primary. Senior execs are drowning in vendor pitches - but a seed VC email lands differently. Why? Because executives actually want that relationship: advisory access, deal flow exposure, networking for their next role. Multi-dimensional value that a software pitch never has. The reply rates show it.
The GTM Engineer title is being misused - and the gap is creating a $500K–$1M+ opportunity. Clay's version is great: a Clay-enabled salesperson. But the highest-value profile right now is someone with deep Salesforce/HubSpot/Gong muscle memory who is also fluent in modern AI tools. Jason calls this the Go-to-Market Architect. Most companies can't find one because the profile is genuinely rare - and the people who have it don't know what they're worth yet.
The 3-in-30 problem: Jason met 30 people to find three. The GTM Architect isn't just technical. They need RevOps chops + AI fluency + enough business acumen to pressure-test a transformation roadmap with a CRO. Most RevOps candidates fall short on that last piece - they're back-office systems people, not revenue-forward thinkers. Sweet spot: someone who spent time in sales or marketing before moving into RevOps.
The Full Stack GTM person is the most exciting emerging role in go-to-market. As tooling consolidates, the walls between marketer, SDR, and AE collapse. You won't need three people for three jobs. You'll need one great person who can generate pipeline in the morning, run discovery midday, and manage key accounts in the afternoon. The best of these people will earn an enormous amount. Everyone else in the middle gets squeezed out.
The "time savings" ROI story is dead - and it was always a little made up. Save X hours, multiply by headcount, multiply by hourly rate. Jason's blunt: that was the best argument we had, not a good one. The bar has moved permanently. If your tool can't demonstrate a real PNL transformation - fewer people driving more revenue - you're going to lose deals to the companies that can make that case.
Salesforce's pricing leverage is at risk for the first time in its history. Nobody loves Salesforce - less than 1% of users would raise their hand. But until now there was no credible path off it. Jason thinks AI-native CRMs and parallel tooling are building toward a moment where companies finally say at renewal: "you're just a database now - we're removing seats." It won't happen this year. But when it tips, it'll tip fast.
Slack might end up being Salesforce's most valuable asset going forward. The core CRM faces real long-term pressure. But Slack has distribution into the daily communication layer of the tech world, right as AI and automation need a delivery channel. A lot of what agents push to end users is going to route through Slack. Surprisingly durable inside an otherwise vulnerable portfolio.
$1M+ IRR per employee is real - and it's raising the bar for everyone else. Jason's seen it up close: 25-person GTM teams running what used to require 200. For most companies, still aspirational. But enough examples exist now that boards are setting expectations accordingly - which is why new comp plans are landing at 5-10x quota coverage and reps are reacting with genuine shock.
Breaking into VC from GTM is less about applying and more about demonstrating. Most of these roles are filled through networks, not job boards. Jason's advice: figure out the one thing you're exceptional at and find a way to help a portfolio company with it. That's your foot in the door. Bonus points if you're dangerous with AI and automation tooling - Primary's own growth team is actively trying to level up, and people who can teach that get noticed fast.
Discussed In This Episode
How Primary's portfolio support model actually works and why "advice-giving" doesn't cut it
The Market Dev team's unfair advantage: why outreach from Primary converts better than any vendor pitch
The Go-to-Market Architect role: why it's different from a GTM Engineer (and why Clay's definition falls short)
Why a profile with deep experience in legacy SaaS tools + fluency in modern AI will easily earn $500K to $1M+/year
How to find the rare 3-in-30: RevOps chops + AI fluency + business acumen
The Full Stack GTM person: one role replacing marketer + SDR + AE
How the PNL test should filter every sales tech investment and why the old "time savings" ROI story is dead
Where Salesforce is headed in the next 10 years and why its pricing leverage is finally at risk
Why Slack might be Salesforce's best asset going forward
Small teams doing massive revenue: what $1M+ IRR per employee actually looks like
How to break into VC from a go-to-market background
Timestamps
(00:00) Intro & Jason's Background: From Law School to NYC Tech
(07:15) The Go-to-Market Operating Partner Role: What It Is (and Isn't)
(11:38) How Primary's Portfolio Support Programs Were Built
(16:42) The Market Development Team: Primary's Unfair BD Advantage
(21:26) Go-to-Market Engineering: Building the Stack for Founders
(25:43) The GTM Architect vs. GTM Engineer and Why the Distinction Matters
(30:09) Why This Profile Will Earn $500K–$1M+ and How to Find One
(34:21) The Full Stack GTM Role: One Person Replacing Three
(37:07) Primary's Investment Thesis: The PNL Test for Sales Tech
(42:30) Where Salesforce Is Headed and Why Its Grip Is Finally Slipping
(49:04) Small Teams, Massive Revenue: GTM Efficiency Benchmarks
(55:35) How to Break Into VC from a Sales/GTM Background

Thanks for tuning in!
If you enjoy it, please give us a rating, review, or follow on Spotify/YouTube/Apple Podcasts - it really helps us grow this.
For those who are new, my name is Chris Balestras, partner @ Vibescaling - a GTM advisory, recruiting, media, and investing firm, working with seed through series C AI-natives to help them grow.
Where to find Vibescaling:
We work with many of the hottest AI-native startups in various capacities, and for those who are interested, shoot me an email at [email protected] or a DM on LI.
🫡 cheers,
Chris
